Kelly apologizes for inflammatory remarks on domestic violence
Published Thursday, March 20, 2008
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Stumble It!JUNEAU — Comments made last week by Rep. Mike Kelly, R-Fairbanks, about victims of domestic violence offended many and led one House member to move her seat away from Kelly’s in the House Finance Committee.
Kelly made his comments during a committee hearing Friday on a bill that would stiffen the penalty for third-time offenders of domestic violence. He said he was concerned that relying more on the law and an overworked police force to address the issue would allow men to shirk the responsibility of “taking care of their women.”
“It just seems to me that the message is clear here,” he said, “that the female — the other half of the population — is falling down because they’re doing stupid things marrying the beasts among us, or shacking up with them.
“The guys that are brothers and uncles and fathers and stuff are not taking care of this problem,” he went on. “I just think it’s one more thing that insidiously is on government, and it bothers me.”
Many of those in the room were stunned by the comments, according to people who were there, and Rep. Mary Nelson, D-Bethel, spoke up.
“To call a woman stupid for not knowing that she’s marrying a wife-beater is very inflammatory,” she said. “Not everyone has a dad living next door. Not everyone’s born with older brothers. Sometimes there are vulnerable people who are preyed upon who need help.”
The discussion ended there and the committee moved on, ultimately voting to move the bill out of committee, with Kelly the only member voting against it.
But the issue didn’t end there.
After the hearing, Nelson asked committee co-chair Rep. Kevin Meyer, R-Anchorage, if she could move her seat on the committee away from Kelly’s, which was next to hers.
Meyer said Wednesday that Nelson had asked to move partly to be closer to the door — she was pregnant and very close to her due date — and partly to distance herself from Kelly.
“She was offended by (his comment), there’s no question,” he said.
Meyer approved the seat change, and on Monday another committee member sat between Kelly and Nelson. Meyer said he couldn’t remember another time in the four years he’s been co-chair when someone had asked to move because of a personal issue with another member.
Kelly said Wednesday he thought he could have made his point in a better way.
“I was too rough, and I should have been more sensitive to the folks who in one way or another are involved,” he said. “I regret my comments, and I apologized to Mary.”
Kelly said he voted against the bill because of the accountability question and also because he thought it was problematic in how it defined domestic violence.
Nelson was in the hospital Wednesday giving birth to a girl.
Community Discussion
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Mr. Kelley- it is much more than sensitive times in which we live, violence and abuse in general are somehow presupposed to be secondary to the apparent larger concerns of disposition of our state's oil wealth.
However, these are the nuts and bolts issues, the truly human issues of your constituents,
your comments belie your thinking, which appears to be all too parochial.
We all hope to trust you to expand your thoughts and wisdom if indeed that day comes while you purport to represent your constituents
Generally, you ain't that bad, but this one leaves you pretty well exposed as a..........
Good point, AKnatuff.
Domestic violence swings both ways. Although men are predominantly the abusers in DV incidents, women can be, and are, perpetrators, too.
As to who do these laws really protect? They protect *everyone.*
Mike you are politician, you dont get to say what YOU think; you are suppoused to say what the people you where elected to represent think. Silly politician, opinions are for people not politicians.
It seems to me that the message is clear here. Females are half the population. That means we have half the vote. The stupid thing would be to re-elect Kelley and his ilk. The brothers, uncles, and fathers can help us by electing people who realize domestic violence is assault, in one way or another, and it is a crime. Perhaps Mr. Kelley would be less bothered if the victims, male or female, and their families took matters into their own hands and “took care of this problem” in the only way available to them, if the criminal justice system does not deal with it.
I wonder exactly what Mike Kelly means when he says, “The guys that are brothers and uncles and fathers and stuff are not taking care of this problem,” he went on. “I just think it’s one more thing that insidiously is on government, and it bothers me.” This sounds very much like the suggestion of vigilantism which a civilized society condemns and attempts to prevent through the use of laws; laws that are passed by the legislature - our government.
Women are not the only victims of domestic abuse and to call ANY victim of abuse “stupid”, is a gross lack of knowledge regarding the subject, not to mention compassion.
Domestic violence is almost epidemic in Alaska and it affects many more than those who suffer the initial assault; it affects our entire community. Maybe it will take a few punches (verbal of course) for that to sink in Mr. Kelly.
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Mike Kelly said the right thing, even if it could have been worded better. Relying on the government to solve the problem is the wrong approach. Men should be taking their responsibilites to protect women and children seriously. The liberals always want the government to solve their problems, because their not willing to take care of their responsibilities.
According to Kelly Logic, it is the fault of the robbery victim if their family doesn't attack the thief or the fault of the guy driving down the road if he doesn't slam into the back of the guy that cut him off illegally.
Assault is assault - period. It is a crime.
Vigilantism is also against the law. And we certainly don't need to have elected representatives encouraging people to break the law - enough of those reps do it on their own as it is!
The way I remember it, was that back in the day, if some idiot mistreated your female relative, you showed up at his house with a baseball bat and mistreated him. It wasn’t elegant, or politically correct, but it got the point across that females were not punching bags. And I know that that was the point that Mr. Kelly was trying to make; that men used to protect their female relatives and friends from the scum that would take advantage of them. More importantly, Mr. Kelly was simply trying to say that today’s “feminized, sensitive” men have shirked their responsibilities as protectors of women.
And although Mr. Kelly's labeling of certain women as "stupid" may not have been sensitive or politically correct, it was very truthful. We ALL know women that for whatever reasons; continually find themselves in abusive relationships. They ignore the obvious “danger signs” that their partners present and they ignore the pleadings of their relatives and friends to get out of the relationship. If that is not “stupid,” then what is?
As far as Mrs. Nelson changing seats to get away from Mr. Kelly; well that’s just childish. What is she, eleven years old? If that’s the “mature way” in which our legislators handle their differences of opinions, then god help us, because we’re in trouble.
And finally, there will be some people who say that women don’t need men to protect them. That’s their opinion and their entitled to it, but I disagree. I believe that any good man should provide for and protect the women in his life, whether they are family, friends, or neighbors.
While Mr. Kelly's comment, "I was too rough, and I should have been more sensitive to the folks who in one way or another are involved," is undeniable, he brings up a very valid point. His is not promoting vigilantism; his concern is that current legislation focuses on the symptom rather than the disease. It is a costly, no-win situation. While the members of our society turn a blind eye to the causes and cyclical nature of domestic violence, the onus is on government to deal with those convicted of it. Stiffer penalties are enacted, yet the problem grows worse.
Domestic violence is a problem that starts with the family and only by addressing it at and within the family will the situation improve.
A large part of the problem is that abusers don't believe that what they are doing IS a crime. And unless society proves it to them with harsh punishment, and , hopefully, reeducates them, they will continue to do it.
What Kelly said what just stupid and I wouldn't have wanted to sit next to him either because he was clearly breathing some intoxicating substance. When Rep. Nelson moved away she was showing him that his words were unacceptable in a non-violent way. Should she have got a gun and shot him? It seems like that would have been Kelly's method.
I am reminded of something I read a number of years ago in an old issue of Reader's Digest. It was in one of the Humor Columns. This guy related how, one day when he went with his "then fiancee" to visit her family, his future Father-in-Law said cheerfully, "Come on, let's go for a ride and get to know each other..." The article related how they drove for a long while - I don't remember exactly how long the author said - but finally, the old man - a Retired Marine Corp Officer - pulled over beside a beautiful meadow somewhere out in the country. The old man got out and stood beside the car gazing out at the field so the writer got out and stood beside him. The old man, still gazing out over the meadow, said, "It's beautiful out here. And this where I'm going to bury your body if you ever hurt my daughter."
I agree with Mike Kelly. He might have had to apologize but I don't. Everyone knows what "vigilanteeism" means nowdays (or they think they do) but the fact is that "Vigilance Committees" came into being in some of the Old American Western Communities BECAUSE THERE WAS NO LAW IN EFFECT THERE AT THAT TIME! We have Laws and Legal Jurisprudence today but sometimes the Justice is absent! I don't have a daughter but I do have a wife, two sisters, a daughter-in-law and a niece and I understand EXACTLY what he said AND I AGREE WITH IT!
While I do agree with the sentiment of Mr Kelly's idea, he'd be shooting himself in the foot if he's that concerned about overburdening the police force/legal system. I think no amount of abuse would be enough to heap upon the low life that beats his wife, but then how many of us would then be arrested for assaulting those low lifes? The hospital bills that would result, legal fees, overcrowded prisons from all of us that "protected our women" would be insurmountable. If they pass a bill that said open season on wifebeaters, I have a louisville slugger that would work great, but advocating violence to stop the violence just sounds a bit stupid, doesn't it?
I believe that there are more laws protecting the perpetrators than the victims. If we know that someone is doing violence to another individual, we can't press charges, it has to be the victim and by the time the family can get involved, it's for burial of the victim. Something needs to change to protect victims who are scared in the first place to press charges because the law does not protect them enough.
My sister was murdered by her husband through domestic violence. We would tell the authorities but they couldn't do anything until she was willing to press charges, she died and finally when the law allowed us to get involved after the fact, he's spending a 99 year sentence but it doesn't get our sister back.
I thought lawmakers were elected to protect the innocent?
I would not want to associate with Rep. Kelly or sit near him after hearing his remarks. What is deep in his heart?
im stupid because my ex was a beater. I admit Im stupid for marrying him.
Many women, and men too, are in these type of relationships because they have low self esteem. They do not think any one else will love them. Low self esteem has nothing to do with being stupid Mr Kelly. However abuse is abuse no matter what the situation is. The law needs to protect the weak. no matter what.And Mr Kelly May I suggest that you spend some time visiting some women in shelters who are there because of domestic violence. I used to be one of those women and you better not call me stupid.
Mr. Kelly has an ethical duty to represent all Alaskans, even those he may consider "stupid." His apology was shallow and does not in any way address his belief system; rather, he apologized because he offended people.
“The guys that are brothers and uncles and fathers and stuff are not taking care of this problem,” could certainly be interpreted to mean that men use violence to protect their families. If we applied Mr. Kelly's logic, we would have more people in jail--only rather than violent abusers, we would have family members in jail.
Studies have shown that victims who recognize the abuse and attempt to flee are at a significant risk of escalated violence and death. In Fairbanks, Lisana Burch was a bright, beautiful, outgoing and smart woman who worked as a business manager. She had the support of friends, co-workers and a caring community. This support didn't stop her ex-husband from brutally murdering her only 3 days after she divorced him.
Children are exposed to domestic violence every day; too many witness the violent death of their parent. Mr. Kelly's ignorance continues to place these children at risk.
Law enforcement put their lives on the line each day responding to domestic violence calls. To suggest that families protect victims puts law enforcement in a position of trying to determine who the "bad guy" really is when they respond to a scene involving weapons.
Contrary to what Mr. Kelly believes, many victims do have families to support them. Is it Mr. Kelly's belief that family can protect a victim against a gunshot?
I'm just not seeing how Mr. Kelly's logic will enhance public safety. Maybe funding victim services and public safety is a better option?
Is it arrogance or ignorance that fuels Mr. Kelly's comment that women are "doing stupid things marrying the beasts among us, or shacking up with them"? If most abusers showed up at the door on the first date, punched their date and drug them into the car, victims wouldn't marry them. Abusers are very manipulative, controlling and charming. Would we apply Mr. Kelly's "logic" to the same abuser who perpetrates a violent robbery rather than domestic violence? Would we simply dismiss the robbery because the victim was walking around with money in a coat pocket? Would we say that the victim's family should have been there to protect the victim? What if it was an armed robbery?
I'm wondering whether Mr. Kelly would make such arrogant remarks if the behavior abusers demonstrate behind closed doors was focused toward their boss, co-worker or the general public.
Mr. Kelly is disconnected. He needs to listen to the people he represents. Or better yet, step down and let someone who is connected with their community do the job.
OK, Mike Kelly is “Disconnected”? Maybe! More probably, he is just plain frustrated. My grandparents were married to each other for over 50 years; my Grandfather did not beat my Grandmother. She “chose wisely” even though she was only 13 years old when she married him. My wife and I just passed our 39th Anniversary in February and I don’t beat my wife either.
One of my favorite radio programs is the Dr. Laura Schlesinger Program. She’s on AM 970 from 1 PM to 3 PM, Monday through Friday. Yes, I know – anyone who didn’t like what Representative Mike Kelly had to say probably doesn’t like Dr. Laura either. In fact, I would venture to bet that most everyone in the United States falls into one of three categories. They either Love her and Listen to her regularly at every opportunity or they Hate her and everything she says and stands for, or they fall into a third category of those who “Live Under a Rock” and never heard of her. Those who hate her frequently haven’t listened to her enough to know what she really preaches or espouses – they just know that if she said it, they disagree with it. Two things she says that bear repeating here, the first is “Choose Wisely – Treat Kindly” and the second is that if a woman does choose wisely and marries a real man, “He will swim through shark-infested waters to bring her a lemonade!”
Reading “between the lines” leads me to believe that there may be one or two (women) who want to blame themselves for “being stupid” – don’t! One thing that those who will disagree with me most vehemently got right is that being beaten is NEVER the victim’s fault! But do exercise caution when you begin to date again (preferably after any children are grown and gone) because statistically the odds are that you will start a new relationship with the same kind of abusive and controlling person UNLESS you exercise caution and get to know them thoroughly BEFORE you marry them.
Well, for more than a decade I thought it a crime that O.J. Simpson got let off the hook for murdering Nichole Brown Simpson. But thanks to Mike Kelly, I now realize that it was her own fault for ever meeting the guy, much less marrying him. And divorcing him? That was over the top. What a stupid, stupid girl. I'm so glad O.J walked free so he could get arrested again. I'm sure Mikey-boy feels the same way.
How about if we adopt a new standard. We'll call it the Kelly Principal. If you know your assailant in any way, then it was your own fault you were the victim of a crime. Blame your family for not taking the perpetrator out of commission before he (or she) had the chance to victimize you. But don't get the cops involved. It's not their job.
Think how this would help clear our clogged courts.
Quit bashing Mike Kelly, people, he's offering real solutions here.
Doug_in_Salcha,
Thank you for emphasizing that the abuse is never the victim's fault. And, congratulations on passing 39 years of marriage! Yay, you!
You sound like a reasonable person, although I find Dr. Laura ego-driven, intolerant, judgmental and offensive. While I realize that air time is expensive, she irritates me when she cuts people off...especially those who are talking about abuse. Too often victims don't have people who listen to them; she certainly doesn't help by being patronizing or impatient.
Many (not all) domestic violence victims grew up in abusive homes. They are unable to recognize the warning signs of abuse because the verbal abuse and emotional abuse have become "normal" to them. Many victims and offenders swear that the violence they witnessed as a child will never happen in their adult lives. Yet, without the skills and education to engage in healthy relationships, they walk straight to what is familiar...because it came from the family.
This is where victim and batterer's intervention services are so critical--education, support, intervention and safety. Until our homes are free from domestic violence, we need to work together to keep victims safe, to hold offenders accountable, and to give those exposed to violence as children new skills. Sadly, today, victim services are funded less than they were funded when oil was 8 bucks a barrel. Alaskan programs are having to choose between hiring necessary staff and paying heating costs.
I hope all of you will put these comments into a letter to the editor since not everyone is able to read this information on line. We need to get this discussion into the public and bring awareness to the amount of families impacted by this crime and start talking about what we can do to ensure victims are safe and that batterer's are held accountable. Mr Kelly's remarks reminded me of 3 things batterer's normally do Deny, Minimize, and Blame.
Mr Kelly has DENIED that there is a true problem out there that needs to be addressed by us - the people in the state of Alaska - He has stated this should be dealt with by the family - This sounds like something from yester-year when we said "don't interfere, this is a family issue" - I had hoped we were well past that but apparently Mr. Kelly didn't get the message that the world has changed and we aren't "their women" anymore - we are individuals!!!
He has MINIMIZED the issues that victims face - there is a complexity to ending a relationship with a batterer that he apparently can not understand - it is not a simple thing of leaving - for most women who are murdered it is when they have ended the relationship - for some women staying in the relationship is the only way they have stayed alive. Just do a search for Lisana Burch and Dorothy Hopson - two beautiful women who are no longer with us due to their decision to end the relationship.
and finally Mr. Kelly has put the BLAME where most batterer's do - ON THE VICTIM - I'm sorry Mr Kelly but my decision to marry someone who later turned out to be abusive was not stupid on my part. He was charming, worked each day, had many friends, came from a decent family, and did not have a sustance abuse issue. He would never have been considered a beast by anyone but what happened in our home was out of sight and was horrendous. Only problem is no one would have believed me if I had have told them - Abuser's do not start out abusive - they are controlling, manipulative individuals who use various tactics to get their needs met at the expense of another person -
Please get your family and friends to write letters to the editor to let Mr Kelly know his remarks, while they did come straight from what he believes, cannot be tolerated in a person elected to serve the people.
“Alaska is number one nationally in per capita domestic violence murder of women--again,” states Judy Cordell, Executive Director of AWAIC, the domestic violence shelter in Anchorage. Hey, aknatuff, if you are a true Alaskan Native, wa wa wa on that. Was your mother an Alaskan Native? Sounds like you have issues. Protection against violence is even for you should you ever need it. Ignorance is bliss. Before you make another ignorant statement, learn to spell. (feminist)(prosecutors)
Kelly, I think you are an idiot, as well as the other Mike who posted.
Maybe I read a different article than you all did. I didn't see Mr. Kelly saying that the victims of DV were to blame and it seems that he just thought the issue at hand was vague and needed further explanation/clarification. Is it possible that he was correct? Is it possible that this was another issue where it addresses something that IS a problem in society, but addresses it in a way that doesn't move toward solving the issue, thus agreeing to it is just a way to make us *feel* better? Did the bill DO something is my question.
If, on the other hand, the bill did accomplish what it was intended to, then Mr. Kelly could certainly have worded his comments better and been less insensitive.
Beyond that, I do think that he was right on one thing - men SHOULD take care of their women better. Daddies should protect their daughters, brothers their sisters, uncles their nieces, etc., and they should do it not only with words, but with actions. Men should stand up when a woman is threatened. I can understand why they don't. They've been browbeaten into not doing these things. They've been told over and over that we women want to do it all on our own and that they should just back it up. Just say "Yes, dear" and everything will be okay. Ladies, we can't have it both ways. We either need them and want them, or we don't.
The law is a wonderful tool. Lawbreakers should be punished to the full extent of the law. But social repercussions go a long way too. Know your buddy is a butt who beats women/children? Don't have a beer with him - tell him he's a jerk, you won't stand for him treating women and children that way. If your buddy doesn't pay child support, don't hang with him, and tell him why. If we all stood up and were proactive when we saw people wrong others, there would be less wrong in the world.
OMG! I didn't realize there was still a debate about whether or not domestic violence was a crime and not the womans fault. About the article: wouldn't it be frekkin awesome if we could take out our own justice on wife beaters...if you want to save law enforcement the trouble I know a lot of great men-beaters who have a serious problem with women beaters-if given the go ahead! My dad owns a shotgun.
“The guys that are brothers and uncles and fathers and stuff are not taking care of this problem,” he went on. “I just think it’s one more thing that insidiously is on government, and it bothers me.”
This line of thinking is the problem.
I was raped by my husband 2x....I was molested as a 3 year old by a neighbor... i didn't even know what was happening,I was told it was BIG KID 'play'. I know scads of people who've been victimized and I don't see the 'brothers and uncles and fathers'taking care of this problem...but perpetuating it. It's been around since the dawn of time...
With your reasoning Kelly, the government should stay out of DIVORCE, CUSTODY, CHILD PROTECTION,.... i could go on and on.... but the truth of the matter is that's what you are in office for, to protect and serve the people you represent, and if this comes out of your mouth so easily like melted butter, I am more than convinced that you are NOT the right man for the job. Take a visit to your local shelter...take inventory of the individuals that are residing there and you'll see that the majority have a history of abuse...victim to perpertrator...perp to victim... it's a cycle and they/we pass it on to our kids, and our families and to the community and there should be protection.
sorry, i didn't know i typed so much:
By your reasoning, what was my father to do IF i had disclosed the rape of my husband....bash his head in, pull out his shot gun... I didn't utter a word to anyone. WHY? Because I was ashamed...I am an educated woman with a degree and career in social work....because I had a kid...I know and see how the law works and who it favors... he'd still get custody(50/50) and I'd be shamed, humilated, victimized again...as it is I am the outcast for I did disclose, but too late...no proof...do you think the courts took it seriously. Do you think Terrance Hall took the truth and punished the perp? No he had the cash, the lawyer, the job,...he had the power...all i was, was a stay at home mother...when the s%$#%^ hit the fan....I was the one that lost my house, my child, my truck, my community, my respect, my American dream....I was victimized again in court. Once when I was being ABUSED by my drunken husband I called a neighbor to come and help (Even though my husband threatened DEATH if I told a soul) The advice my neighbor gave me was " Maybe he needs more sex...." My fear was so great and I had nowhere to go that i'd literally lock myself and my infant child in my truck and spend the night with the cell phone...until he was sober. He didn't show this side of himself when we first married and he certainly didn't show this side to the community. But 7 years later...here I was married to a prominent man in the community, a Sourdough with a LARGE FAMOUS family....I was the Cheechako, the outsider, 5000 miles from my FATHERS, BROTHERS, AND UNCLES...and I was trapped in a violent marriage to a drunk(and maybe a crank meth head..i dunno, I just know he grew violently angry and mean), who emotionally and physically abused me... What was i to do Kelley? He walked out one morning b/c he almost picked up a gun and shot me...i still tremble when i think about that morning. We're divorced, he's remarried, we share custody and you mark my words....this will come to light one day, there will be another VICTIM, hopefully it won't be my daughter Mr Kelley. I am so glad that I have equal protection and rights! I hope your Mother, SIsters, Daughters, Cousins, Neices, and even your nephews girlfriend and his offspring(being raised by another man) won't ever be victim or prey!
i have never hit a woman but i came real close one time. most men are taught when they are kids that only cowards do that. i think experts say that it is a learned behavior from watching one of their parents beat up on the other. i think if somebody ever even thinks about hitting their wife or girlfriend it is time to leave and if somebody hits their kid they probably shouldnt have a kid. we have too much domestic trouble here and everywhere. parents need to be an example and also teach their kids how to control their temper even when they are being pushed because what they learn when they are kids is probably how they will act when they are grown.
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